ANTI-EU UKIP party has made strong ground in local elections in Britain, suggesting European Parliament elections could go the same way.
The UK Independence Party, led by Nigel Farage, has taken seats from Prime Minister David Cameron’s Conservatives, and from the opposition Labour Party.
The results indicate that UKIP could also so well in the European Parliament elections, held the same day.
The European election results will be announced on Sunday evening, in line with the rest of the EU.
Cameron has promised to try to reshape Britain’s ties with the EU if re-elected next year, and to give Britons an in/out EU membership referendum by the end of 2017.
UKIP, however, wants an immediate referendum.
If Britain was to leave the EU, it could have serious implications for expats living in Spain.
At the moment, all EU citizens have the right to live, work, study and retire in any other EU country.
But Farage not only wants to see Britain out of the EU, but also ‘Europe out of the EU’.
UKIP have won 86 new seats in the elections, according to partial results from a third of councils, which will pressure on Cameron to stiffen his approach to Europe.
Jeremy Browne, a Liberal Democrat lawmaker said on BBC TV: “I think Nigel Farage for quite a lot of those people is just a big sort of two fingers stuck up at what they feel is a sort of hectoring, out-of-touch elite.”
£1.25 million per MEP P.A. 10’s of thousands of kids being paid child benefit legally who have never put a foot in the UK, Terrorists that you have to spend millions on legally and take 10 years to get them out of the Country, Wife of hook man living in central London in a house worth over £1 million and we pay the housing costs for years and years, then he has kids in prison for years costing whatever that is per year, the Country is sinking under the weight of people coming in, no houses (try not to say this is racist) I said people not a Country or skin colour etc. I would prefer to stay in Europe but can those idiots not see the UK is going to leave unless they show some flexibility and after they have expanded Europe to take in 28 Countries it needs some of the rules adjusting. All the things above mean the pensioners will be next to be hit, not buss passed, TV fees, WFA in the UK, means testings and so on, Government employee pension will have to go down even more. What was I reading the other day, if you were contracted out of SERPS (state earnings related pension scheme) then you will not get the full £155 a week pension that is coming out. OK, but if you are on the dole your stamp is paid and you will get the full amount. If you earn over £50k you child benefit reduces and disappears at £60k, if a couple earn £49k each they keep it. Until they wake up this is only going one way.
Al my life I had voted conservative but if I was still living in the U.K UKIP would be getting my vote.
It’s not until the open door policy of the labor government that these problems arose. There were never a shortish of housing, hospital places, housing, schools, doctors and so forth before and plenty of house available to purchase at a decent prices.
My son was part of a IBM team that were invited to parliament to give a synopsis on immigration. It was suggested that immigration was required to boost the aging population regarding future pensions, BUT immigration required a strict immigration policy and need to be controlled.
This was not heeded, hence the current immigration policy we now have and stuck with.
I recall immigration was allowed prior to the Common market, but it was Strictly controlled. One could either work on a farm, a hospital, domestic or on the railway. This had to be covered with a letter by the appropriate employer that the job was available.
I used to get really annoyed when I heard Brits talking about ‘the common market’ being very pro Europe at the time.
What I missed, the gods know why was the clause – ‘free movement of labour and capital’. The EU was’nt created to serve the interests of ordinary people, it was created solely to further the interests of big business aka the common market.
Ask the Germans/Dutch/Belgians and Swedes if they are happy with the invasion of Eastern Europeans and asylum seekers. The overwhelming majority are not.
Especially small countries like the Netherlands or the UK. Great news for the BTL scum in the UK as it keeps the rents rising and they get tax cuts as well.
There simply is no need to build lots more houses in the UK, especially on prime farming land – confiscate all the BLT properties and second homes – problem solved. Bring in capital gains taxes on all property transactions – who truly benefits from rising house prices – the mortgage lenders.
When the pro immigration lot talk about the benefits of mass immigration and how they contribute to the economy they never ever mention the cost bomb waiting to explode in the future – pensions and because many will not have worked enough years to get a full pension will demand social security top-ups, rent rebates, not earning enough to pay their local taxes – it goes on and on.
The last thing this planet needs is more bipeds but hey lets have 8/9 why not 10 kids. The French are seriously worried because soon they will be outnumbered by Islamic people who now living in France have absolutely no reason to continue with the madness of large families. The French Catholics will say they are doing their bit for France by having large families – the madness goes on and on.
You can say what you like about Nigel Farage but to see him chew up and spit out the mendacious and stupid fool that Clegg is was wonderful.
Is he and his party the best thing since sliced bread, no definately not but until the British people demand and get real P/R nothing will change since the two parties reside in some comfort up the rear end of big business.
Never being in that position I would like to know if any Brit or immigrate has reaped the benefits in Spain like they do in the U.K, or is just the U.K the biggest sucker out.
Obviously Cleggie and Co have forgotten the words of Churchill——
IF BRITAIN MUST CHOOSE BETWEEN EUROPE AND THE OPEN SEA ….. SHE MUST ALWAYS CHOOSE THE OPEN SEA…..
a timely reminder has been issued by the British people whatever colour their skin is . Patriot forever racist never !
What’s colour got to do with racism ? Any nationality or colour can, indeed often is, racist.
Good comments. There are 15, 000 or so houses being built in Kent soon, not far from the M25, right next to a Euro tunnel station and high speed 1 train to get you to London in no time and I expect there will be a queue of BTL investors from all over the world ready to snap them up in a couple of weeks. I think if they built another 500k houses over the next year they would all be sold, especially if they are in the south. I am not against foreigners, I am married to one and if it were not for the 141 Polish fighter pilots maybe the battle of Britain would have looked a bit different, plenty of them died and of course we are foreigners when in a different Country but the EU does need to revisit the way it works if they want to survive.
The EU does need reform and if UKIP’s success in the UK and Front National in France helps bring that about then perhaps they will have have served a useful purpose. I saw a piece on Euro News the other night where one of the front runners for Barrosso’s job was asked why there was apathy among EU voters and how did he get his policies across, he replied before quickly correcting himself that the voters didn’t need to know his policies as the voters wouldn’t be having a say in him getting the job.
Wow, great response from the last few comments, like it. Farage for me all the time. He certainly has shaken the olive tree’s and placed the U.K first. How it will affect immigrates to other E.U countries we do not know, but it’s worth a gamble, being a “little splutter” me-self.
One only needs to see Farage speaking at the E.U regarding a democratic vote. “Who are you”, he asked old rumpy “I’d never heard of you and doubt very much if anyone else had, yet you earn more then the President of the U.S of America and come from a small country that does not even have a Government”, (that was at the time) That’s the democracy he was talking about, in not allowing the people of Europe having a vote as to who could sit at the top table in the E.U.
He even had a go at war monger Blair.
Most of those in the E.U Parliament where communists at one time anyway, even Barrosso.
Lets not see to much in this yes ukip may shake up the politicians at Westminster and the anti eu parties accross europe may shake the eu tree but when you have a completely none elected elite running the commission nothing will change the whole system needs re writing but untill the big players like germany and france pitch in this will not happen.
One point though seem to be left out farage and his crowd have only got 200 or so seats on councils in ENGLAND out of some 8000 do the maths
The Uk is a democracy but for years if you spoke about immigration you were called a rascist or a bigot
Europe was ok as a sort of super trade agreement but no one wants Political Union/I mean why have a House of Lords House Of Parliament MPs even the royal family if we are politically controlled by the EU/ are they all going to be relogated to the role of a Parish Council
People want to in a democracy discuss these issues and thats why UKIP is getting votes
Don’t know why such criticism of BTL owners. Most are ordinary savers trying to have more than one egg in their investment baskets. Savagely lower bank interest and rapid stock market declines saw many looking for other investments. When property started to swiftly rise in value (1990/2) and good rentals were received BTLs became winners to offset losses elsewhere. Then property prices dropped, 30/40% and it was left for the rents to bring in return on a par with bank interest but maybe with value of the property being negative. Now interest is rock bottom and there is a property rise in progress. Demand for rentals seem to be dropping off in my area. Thus as in any area of investment it is a roller coaster and much care needs to be taken as to when to change horses. BTLs involve market risk, capital gains tax, stamp duty and I fail to understand the hatred for those who have just attempted to find ways to better themselves. It is for governments and banks to tie this in with the effects on immigration etc. Is there some kind of envy here. I assure you most people find owning property to let very depressing what with damage, rental gaps and fickle and non-paying tenants. Nothing’s easy
The leader of this party is just a trivial racist!
Do you really want this buffoon running your country?
Farage has been a breath of fresh air that was needed in British Politics. It shows by the reaction of the three other parties and they are at last taking note of what the people are saying. 200 seats were better then none and no doubt it will increase. Remember even the Labor party at one time had no seats at all but was grown through the disenchanted of people.
The other parties insist that the UKIP votes are a protest vote only but never mention that at each General Election is also a protest vote if the opposition wins.
That’s what democracy means.
Of course there is no chance of this buffoon running the country. Voters are just saying that changes have to be made and this seems an ideal opportunity for the two(three) major parties to get their electoral houses in order. The likelihood is that the party which makes the most promises to change our participation entry will win the next General Election. Old party allegiances are due to go out of the window on this issue. Unfortunately if they do not make acceptable proposals it is hard to envisage a clear next route for the UK.
The buffoon has never said he wished to run the country, could not survive on a PM salary, much prefers the E.U salary.
caccia, he’s not that daft then
Bad seeds always start from somewhere.
He’s a dangerous man fronting this racist party, who knows exactly what kind of people he can appeal to.
So basically what you are saying is that your quite happy with the political system as is it, or dose it need a little shove now and then to remind them that there are people besides the cronies running the country.
What, a stock broker being daft!
your being very disengenous about who the BTL crowd are. The overwhelming majority have lots of properties, indeed some have over 500. Where do you think the bankers invest their multi-million £ bonuses?
No other country in Europe has tax breaks for property investors and indeed most of the successful countries in northern Europe and Scandinavia control their property markets with a firm hand.
Property produces zero wealth for a country it just ties up capital that should be invested productively.
“A breath of fresh air” / Pooh! call that fresh ? When the National Front blew away, it’s scum migrated to the B.N.P.
The B.N.P. is dribbling it’s followers away now. Where do you think they have switched to ? That’s right, UKIP the new home of the deranged. The man who rides the one-trick-pony, welcomes all comers, as long as they have been lobotomised.
Big changes are coming, be aware, you voice I’m afraid is lost.
Roll on UKip.
who should people vote for – the nasty party that has looted virtually everything that was once owned outright by all the British people.
Or should they vote for a party that has always shied away from being called the Socialist party and has virtually no working people left in it. This is the party that continued with PFI which is bankrupting the NHS. This is the party that wanted to have giant casinos where people could blow all their money. This is the party that sold all our gold for $250 an ounze, just as gold was taking off. This is the party that did bugger all to rein in the greedy bankers, indeed this is the party that bailed out the banks when it was the elite that would have lost most of their loot. Instead they made the ordinary taxpayer to pick up the tab. This is the party that never attempted to jail the thieving corrupt bankers.
So the ordinary man and woman should vote for who? Is either party (the LibDems are finished) going to support real democracy with straight forward P/R – you must know this is never going to happen with either bunch of self serving scum.
The EU must be totally reformed stripping away all the massive perks. Reforming the CAP so that all subsidies go only to small farmers. Mass immigration is good for the elites as this serves many different purposes that increase their profits and control (fear) of ordinary European people.
Yesterday’s voting comes as no surprise to me at all, keeping in touch with people all over Europe it was what I expected. The elites must learn to overcome their addiction to power and greed or their worst nightmares will come to pass.
Democracy is – rule by the people, Fascism is – rule of the people. Virtually all those on the EU gravy train have treated the ordinary man and woman with contempt.
Today all of Europe knows that a real sea change in mentality has occurred. I think that the hubris of the political classes across Europe will not allow them to see the end game of their arrogance and greed.
Ya know Stuart, it’s the first time I have ever agreed to what you have said and was a pity you did miss that clause, “free movement of people and capital” but can now see the light.
Nothing wrong with what was the common market and free trade with the rest of the world. Too much control of the E.U in every one’s lives, you can tell by the communist crowd that currently rule the E.U. The lady would be the first in not turning and it was up to Farage to follow in her footsteps. Farage may never make a leader of a country but it was through him that has really shaken the sh..ts on the Uni class people who have never done a day’s work in their lives. Vote for the people as Nigel would say.
Even now, Cameron lower’s his credibility by his defeat as being a very poor loser and can’t really understand why we need a referendum in 2 years time. The flood gate is still open during that period for a possible extra millions to quickly arrive just in case. It should be stopped now and the decision to reopen once an agreement has been made between the E.U and U.K or remain closed. Those that had arrived from a set date to be returned to their own country if not working and contributing into the U.K system with x amount of years to gain the privileges of the welfare state the same as the British people who have paid towards during their working lives. Amen.
Another side of the argument is always missed, where do all the British ex pats live when Britain has left the EU and spiteful continental governments throw them out. Anybody thought of that.
Peter: I have – and mentioned it many times on here. We are witnessing the unedifying spectacle of turkeys voting for Christmas. Those governments you mention are capable of worse things than simple expulsion.
Stuart: To reform the E.U. requires one to be IN the tent, not outside weeing on it. Just as Capitalism needs control and rules, (the “free market as it is at present, is simply the law of the jungle) so the E.U. needs a firm hand and evolutionary change. NOT destruction. Those people we vote to send to Brussels, need greater scrutiny (by us) and should be chosen for what they intend to do on our behalf once there. Voting required!
The man with pint and fag wants us to take our ball home and not play any more. He should be known as The Incredible Sulk.
Unfortunately people are conflating voting for M.E.P. candidates with votes in a general election in Britain.
VERY different animals. It’s worth noting that UKIP of course does not presently have one single M.P. in the Commons. If they ever do, they would be like a dog chasing a bus, they wouldn’t know what to do with it when they catch it. You left out what could and should be a significant voice in Europe Stuart, The Greens.
Careful bud, Caccia is starting to agree with you.
All taken care of, don’t worry!.
quite right, that’s the elephant in the room that so many expats refuse to acknowledge.
It’s not a case of being thrown out of any country – it’s the health costs.Last year I spent 2 weeks in an excellent French hospital. Because it was an illness which the French describe as of ‘long duration’ I had virtually nothing to pay BUT it was the UK that picked up the tab which was around €20K, will that change if the UK leaves the corrupt madhouse, it is this that will dictate whether expats stay or leave.
It is such health costs that would be a nightmare for all but the wealthiest foreigners.
Stefanjo, do you really think that those on the gravy train will ever change it? Caccia is quite wrong as usual, there are many ex-communists (Iv’e known quite a few such scumbags personally) – most eventually joined the nasty party in the UK, same goes for other European countries as well.
Sorry to say that those we elect, treat us with contempt and always will for one simple reason – the Brits talk a good talk but the thought of picking up the gun means losing control of their bodily functions. This is not so in France/Netherlands/Germany or a lot of other countries. Do you really think that Brits en mass would be as brave as the Tunisians/Libyans or Egyptians, never and sad to say but the elite in the UK know this very well.
If you think that the EU would countenance removing the clause about free movement of labour and capital then you are dreaming.
If the EU was worth a damn then it would have forced all member countries to introduce PR – it did’nt and we Brits get the self seeking scum that will never change the system that keeps them so comfortably in control.
The Greens – not in the UK, it’s become Americanised, most have bought the dream and are quite happy if they can feed at the consumer trough.
Stuart: Bit confused by your stance. Are you in favour of dissolving the E.U. ? Back to tight borders, huge queues at immigration desks for simple holidays, import/export controls, MORE suspicion and hatred of foreigners, Impossibility of working and living elsewhere, international policing curbed, extradition for criminals halted. I’m sure you could add to this list.
But what I find worrying is your idea that democracy no longer works (if I read you right) and that freedom and fairness issue from the barrel of a gun. The so-called Arab Spring, Egypt Libya etc.(guns and violence) don’t so far seem to have brought about the idyll of freedom and contentment. I doubt it will. The old war-monger, (you know who) said one correct thing, Democracy, for all its faults, is the least worst option on the table. Oh OK, two things. “Jaw jaw, is better than war war”.
As far as UKIP goes, the UK NEEDS immigration. People miss this point. BTW, If people feel angry, don’t have a go at immigrants, spend your energy having a go at rich multinational corporations who are slowly destroying our planet, not at poor people. This isn’t the bigger problem.
Voting for the leader of this party just because he smokes and drinks pints ‘like regular people’.
It’s no reason to vote for a racist party just because you’re not ‘happy with the political system’ Caccia
Don’t forget the comment example by William Henwood from UKIP about Lenny Henry suggesting if he “wants a load of blacks around, go and live in a black country”. Even though he resigned afterwards, it represents UKIP’s view. We are not racist say UKIP continually.
Why do they have to keep saying this? THINK!
If anyone thinks UKIP aren’t racist or attracting racists, you’re simply WRONG!
“Impossibility of working and living elsewhere”
Really? So British people have been unable to emigrate to Australia and New Zealand ever since they lost the right of abode there in the early 1970s?
No they haven’t, they just need to apply for visas based on a points system to live and work there. Same with Canada, and that quintessential nation of immigrants, the US. Indeed in Europe (as opposed to the EU) it’s much the same if they want to go and live in Switzerland.
On solution would be for British expatriates who don’t want to leave Spain: take out Spanish citizenship, though they might need to start learning Spanish.
Europe is a geographical and cultural concept.
The EU is an organization of European states.
Being against the EU is not to be against Europe.
Anselmo: How perspicacious of you. We’d never have known if you hadn’t told us.
Excuse me. But I think that the headline of the article can lead to confusion, regarding the UKIP, and I wonder if define the UKIP as anti-European, is an attempt to prejudice public opinion against them.
My comment was regarding communism in the EU, I said quote:-
MAY 24TH, 2014 4:50 AM
“Most of those in the E.U Parliament where communists at one time anyway, even Barrosso”. Could that be disputed please.
Stuart said quote:-
“Caccia is quite wrong as usual, there are many ex-communists (Iv’e known quite a few such scumbags personally) – most eventually joined the nasty party in the UK, same goes for other European countries as well”. Stuart what is wrong, please explain?.
Derek said quote- “It’s no reason to vote for a racist party just because you’re not ‘happy with the political system’”.
Derek why do you think people vote, is it because they are happy or not happy with the political system.
Please explain the differnce. I think you should listen to Farage a bit closer, he has said many time he is not a racist, all are welcomed into the UK providing it’s for a proper and right reason.
The National Front and B.N.P. have gone down the toilet in Britain. Their new home is UKIP. Those creeps didn’t just “go away” they never do, they just find another body to infect.
Farage is generally careful to let the racist nuts fill in their own blanks in his “manifesto”. That’s why he keeps having to sack those who open their gobs too wide and give his game away.
The BNP is in terminal decline and the rats are jumping ship. Farange & co constantly deny that UKIP is a racist or homophobic party to try avoid the same fate, but he has to say enough to encourage the low lifes to vote for him. It is a balancing act he is good at. For a party leader to target minority groups ‘he has problems with’ is a despicable act. He is a wealthy man and as such would avoid the violent unrest his racists policies would eventually cause.
Stepfango & reill,
I can see that you both don’t see or understand where Farage is coming from.
He is fighting for the freedom of the British people and the freedom of an elected governments to control their own country. His thoughts are not new and his speeches over the last ten years as a MEP has consistently fought for this to happen, not only in the UK but these challenges also have taken place in Europe. Won’t go into a lot of detail, take too long. Europe has changed dramatically from being a common market where Britain could trade world wide without the interference of the EU. I had voted for a Conservative government all my voting years but would vote for UKIP if still living in the UK and can’t understand why people say “It’s a protest vote”. Each government that is turfed out in a general election is due to a protest vote, and if, God forbid, Cameron is replaced by red Ed it would also be a protest vote.
Stef: The Labour Party have been accused of “cheating” Milton Keynes residents after it emerged that one of their councillors was formerly second in command of a local neo-Nazi group.
Councillor Margaret Burke, was a far-right extremist who ran the Milton Keynes November 9th Society with her then husband Terry Flynn in the early 1980s.
They both wore Nazi-style uniforms and recruited gangs of local youths to hand out racist leaflets and daub buildings with swastikas, as reported by the Milton Keynes Citizen. I can give more examples…
Racists are in every party as Trevor Philips said on the Andrew Marr show yesterday. As UKIP are expanding rapidly they will still have a few who slip through the net. Rather than trying to distract this thread and side track everyone you should be talking about what should be done to get everyone on board. Yes, of course your free health care may well go down the toilet if we are out of the EU but what you are doing has been tried by lib / lab / con and it has not worked if you did not notice. Move on to the main issues now please as it would be more interesting to read, it is boring to keep reading your racist rubbish and that by Derek. I am happy UKIP won at the Euro elections and I hope they win in Newark soon. It is helping to concentrate minds a bit more. I did read the other day that after the EU elections the EU also wants another £3.8bn and £500m of that from the UK to dish out to Ukraine and unemployed… As said, I do not really want to be out of the EU but I do not also want to be in it under the existing format with 28 Countries, most of them not in the 1st world. What were the numbers, 4 million more under labour. When I was watching Teresa May the other week on the Andrew Marr show it was pathetic, he asked a straight forward question about immigration numbers and she said they are committed to getting it down to the 10’s of thousands, now even my 13 year old knows that they have no say in how many come here so why make herself look so stupid in stating that that is still their goal. They know they are not going to get there so why lie about it. What we need to do is let the wealth creators and the intelligent people in (doctors etc) and keep the numbers roughly where there are now as we have run out of space. I was at Leamington Spa golf course on Saturday night, I was out on the terrace and someone told me they are going to build 110 houses right next to the course, the person informed me that the course will now be ruined, yes more green land is going and it will continue. When UKIP launch their manifesto, if it makes sense they could well be in a coalition. DON’T BE BLINKERED PEOPLE,MOST ARE, move on to the real subjects Stefanderek.
very saddened that you replied to my post like a 1st year student.
The UK has been in the EU for 40 years – how much has it managed to change the corrupt organization and it’s gravy train and yet you say we should’nt leave – when are these changes going to occur. Even after the massive no vote from quite a few countries, the old political/bureaucratic club is still in control, they are not going to countenance change so how are changes to be made stefanjo – lets hear real concrete solutions to these problems.
Impossibility of working/living abroad, utter nonsense people have been living and working in other European countries long before the EU was created eg. my father as a 16 year old was working in a 5* hotel on the Italian lakes and how did the system work then – simple, he got a job in Italy because an Italian got work in the UK.
A brilliantly simple system that I think most Europeans would endorse wholeheartedly.
Living in other European countries – people from the UK have been living in Italy/Greece/France for centuries.
Extradition – ditto.
International co-operation between police – ditto.
Hatred of foreigners, strong words and way over the top.
What I really find incredible is that you think the UK or any other country in the EU has had at any time let alone now – real democracy. You say vote for the Greens – what a complete waste of time. Democracy means having representation and input into how a society is run, it simply does’nt happen for the majority of the people in the UK or lots of other countries.
The only democratic country in Europe is Switzerland. There, any new laws have to be agreed by a majority of the people of a canton BEFORE it becomes law.
What few rights people have were not given but fought for – perhaps you have forgotten the Peterloo massacre or the terrible beatings that Welsh miners suffered at the hands of the police and not a few died. More recently the terrible police brutality meeted out at Orgreave.
Would any of this have happened if the people were armed – of course not. Total responsibility frightens a lot of people, they would rather have someone else to give the orders, so when things go wrong they can say ‘I was only obeying orders’.
On another post you talked about the unconscious racism of many Spanish but look at your statement about the Arabs/Berbers and Egyptians.
The Aryans came pouring off the Steppes about AD300. They began to attack Celtic Britain about AD400. By weight of numbers they were able to steal and create what they call England. Around 600 years later another lot of Aryans invaded aka the Normans. They despised the drunken Engli and Saxons and imposed all kinds of hardships on them.
So after 1600 years the ‘English’ still do not have anything approaching real democracy and you have the gall to say that after a couple of years the peoples of North Africa should – pure hypocracy and a very racist statement.
If it takes the North Africans say a couple of hundred years to achieve real democracy they will make you look very, very inferior.
Also you have never had to suffer the tyranny that these people have. Talking sometimes works but not with unreasonable despots. The despots of North Africa were not ousted by the elites, they had too much to lose. No it was the ordinary courageous people who achieved this and the only way they could was by armed rebellion.
So tell me how you would have removed the dictators in Libya/Tunisia and Egypt – clear precise answers please.
If the UK is such a wonderful democracy why are’t you living there.
Vote UKIP, if you can, or the party in France if you are registered who’e principles are similar to Farage at least you know they are fighting for the rights of people. Why not see him on YouTube, it may give you a better understanding of where he is coming from.
See Blair is still after the job at the EU, that’s all we need.
Caccia, Reap and my God, Stuart. What a team. And a great example of filling in the blanks for Nigel.
Caccia: your first paragraph could have issued from beneath a certain toothbrush moustache in the thirties.
Reap: I’m no cheerleader for Any party, least of all a party that spawned Blair. There are degrees of horror and Ukip is well up there in my view.
Stuart: Looks like you will need to take caccias advice on voting principles. But in your case Marine Le Pen, no ? Your ideal (armed) society looks and smells a lot like the U.S.
Did you see Blair’s speech the other day on T.V doing a turn-about regarding the EU. Watch his reply to Farage on YouTube when it was his term at the EU. A man to be trusted.